Metaphysics reply to junior_smith ,I like it Mr Smith

Discussion in 'Metaphysics' started by OdraNoel, Jan 18, 2005.

  1. OdraNoel

    OdraNoel New Member

    (Dear Moderator) junior_smith wrote:

    A theory on, well Chaos theory. And a theory on the future.

    I have a question for you, if we programmed into a computer, everything about science, and the history of the whole world and man kind from aristotle to the a-bomb, could we then see what would happen in the future?

    Now chaos theory might tell us that, it could be a possibility , but it is not 100% for sure, just like the comp program might take a right at a forking path where as man might take a left.

    but then if chaos theory does not exist, then we could get it right.

    i'm sure im not the first person to think of this, byut i did do so on my own and i am interested to hear what other people thought.

    OdraNoel replied:

    whewww!! The history part.. assimilating it to put it into computer would be tough... whose history would you use?

    Whose outcome would the computer be predicting? All fact? What is fact or fiction and who knows once it gets written down, i.e The Bible, do we take it literally, many say we're not meant to, so how would we input that, or leave it out?

    Would you use a model, multiples? Data such as Weather info (hasn't been documented long)

    Good stuff.. I think your hypothesis is a branch of what will be used to create AI.

    Odra Noel Gallagher:D

    [Edited on 18-1-2005 by OdraNoel]

    [Edited on 18-1-2005 by OdraNoel]
  2. junior_smith

    junior_smith Premium Member

    well in all honesty i knew such things would not be possible but it is a cool question to put out there, because if you read sun tzu, the outcome of anything can be calculated, but reading chaos theory there are many different outcomes
  3. oortpower

    oortpower Member

    I would like too add that it would have to be the entire universe down to the exact placement of quarks. You might not think that a little lost positron on the other side of the Universe affects the course of human history but chaos theory says it might. So you would need an amount of storage that is impossible to comprehend, one picosecond would take up more space than all the computers of mankind, also it would be impossible because the act of measuring the things would disturb them. But IF you could and you loaded it into a computer called, say, ENIAC 3K, then you could not just predict Earth when you queried ENIAC 3K but the rest of the Universe as well. If you knew what was going to happen and IF you couldn't changing then all your life and your relations lives, heck the whole universe's life would be known. What would be the point in living?

    [Edited on 1~19~2005 by oortpower]
  4. OdraNoel

    OdraNoel New Member

    Ow! Now my head Is Really Hurting.

    Yes I agree... impossible at our current level of technology to even attempt to consider really. Non-Linear pathways, the effect of decisions by humans or even the unpredictable movements/actions of animals stop us from following the course and after all...if we did where would the fun be in that?

    However!, models using Chaos Theorum in future or Chaos type systems may well become so advanced that as tools they may take us further into the future than just predicting climate change and weather forecasts.

    And as I mentioned I believe that these future systems will hold the key to the first truly autonomous AI systems, and then LOOK OUT!! I heard the other day (can't remember where that that Isaac Asimovs robotic rules wouldn't work, that even with todays cruise missiles the one thing on their minds until they achieve their goal is pure self preservation.) I don't agree though, too early to talk of a cruise missile programme in terms of AI. I don't think we'll see true self preservation (or human consideration) in AI until there is true robotic autonomy)

    Anyone care to further this thought?

  5. Young William

    Young William Premium Member

    Ralph Abraham's work entitled "Chaos, Gaia, Eros " ISBN- 0-06-250013-9, is a very good read, however predictions are always flawed. The best example I can think of is the mathematical calculations involved in any space pregram. Remember, both Voyager spacecraft were extremely successful even though the ground-based team over and under-estimated numerous "unpredictabilities."

    Perhaps, that's one of the greatest parts of our existence. And c'mon the "strong" and "weak" force? Surely we cannot believe the rest of the universe follows our "timeclock."