Physical Science [OFFICIAL] Lifters: Construction and Explanation

Discussion in 'Physical Science' started by Zsandmann, Nov 17, 2004.

  1. Zsandmann

    Zsandmann Premium Member

    This project will investigate 'lifters' AKA 'asymmetric capacitors'

    Statement of Problem Needs Refinement

    Investigate Lifter Theory
    Past Research
    Self-Sustained Power Supply? (Can it lift its power supply?)
    Power Source: Tesla Coil, Moray Valve, FE generator, solar capacitor

    Team Leader:
    Team Members: Waxy_Cheesecake, Zsandmann, JcMinJapan, Mizar, OddTodd, pdoke2003

    Keywords to research: Biefeld-Brown Effect, dielectric pump, Thomas Townsend Brown, ballistic ionic wind, ionic drift

    well, ive been reading alot about lifters lately and decided to build one. i got the instructions from i had most of the supplys and easily found the others with one exception. i had a hell of a time finding 30 gauge enamled wire. i took almost a week of calling everyday and getting passed from one store to the next. i finally found a radio supply store and got the wire and will hopefully be able to assemble it tomarrow.

    what i was wondering was if anyone had expirimented with this at all and if they had any suggestions. i do have expirience with electronics and electricity, and probably more importantly i have common sense, so dont worry about that.

    well, any advice would be greatly appreciated and taken into consideration. And of course ill keep you all updated and try to get some pictures and maybe even a video with my digital camera of the test.

  2. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    Power Source

    CAUTION: You run at least 20,000 volts of electricity through the circuit. If you don't build it right one of two things could happen. One, it could burst into flame, two, it could shoot electricity to anything too close and fry it.

    [EDIT] More like 30 kV from what I read. We need to focus on what we wants for the source and how to obtain it.
  3. Zsandmann

    Zsandmann Premium Member

    Annotated Bibliography

    Arxiv Article: Force on an Asymmetric Capacitor. Army paper on lifter properties and possible propulsion applications.

    Websites to Check Out

    Lifter photos and video About TT Brown Transdimensional Technologies
    The JLN Labs home page American Antigravity
    Here is a fairly good thread from ATS on this.
    Also, here is a great site on how to build it.
    Also, here is a great site on how to build it.

    Papers to Find

    Stein, W. B. “Electrokinetic Propulsion: The Ionic Wind Argument.” Purdue University Energy Conversion Lab, Hangar #3, Purdue Airport West Lafayette, IN 47906, September 5, 2000, on Web at This Link

    Talley, R. L. “Twenty First Century Propulsion Concept.” Veritay Technology, Inc. 4845 Millersport Highway, East Amherst, N.Y. 14051, Report prepared for the Phillips
    Laboratory, Air Force Systems Command, Propulsion Directorate, Edwards AFB CA 93523–5000.

    Cheng, Sin-I. “Glow discharge as an Advanced Propulsion Device,” ASRS Journal vol. 12, p 1910–1916 (1962).

    Christenson, E. A. and P. S. Moller. “Ion-Neutral Propulsion in Atmospheric Media,” AIAA
    Journal vol. 5, no.. 10, p. 1768–1773 (1967).

    See the Web site of Evgenij Barsoukov, AntiChaosClub

    See sections 2, 5 and 15 of L. D. Landau and E. M. Lifshitz. “Electrodynamics of Continuous
    Media.” 2nd Edition, NY: Pergamon Press, 1984.

    Loeb, L. B. “Fundamental Processes of Electrical Discharges in Gases,.” p. 191, New York:
    John Wiley & Sons, 1939.

    Brown, S. C. “Basic Data of Plasma Physics,” p. 62. New York: John Woley & Sons, 1959.

    Stratton, J. A. “Electromagnetic Theory,” p. 104. New York: McGraw Hill Book Company,

    Abraham, M. and R. Becker. “The Classical Theory of Electricity and Magnetism,” p. 95. New York: Hafner Publishing Co. Inc., Second Edition, 1950.

    Stratton, J. A. “Electromagnetic Theory,” p. 139. McGraw Hill Book Company, N.Y., 1941

    Alright Waxy we will pick or more members as we can but let's begin the prep work. First off lets edit our posts to add new data instead of creating a really long thread.

    Step 1: Define our goal.
    Step 2: Gather research.
    Step 3: Construction and documentation
    Step 4: Data analysis
    Step 5: Write up
  4. Zsandmann

    Zsandmann Premium Member

    Biefeld-Brown Effect and explanation

  5. JcMinJapan

    JcMinJapan Premium Member

    Device Location

    [JCM] I want to build one at my house. I love to build stuff and this is very interesting for me. I have spent alof of time reading about it today. I am trying now to understand the gravity and electropropulsion (aether) on this.

    [Z] I think if we could build two devices with identical plans at seperate locations, we could see if any results are truely reproduceable results, independant of the builder. The power source is going to be the toughest item to procure.
  6. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    Power Supply

    [Computer Monitor]

    [Waxy] The most commonly used power supply is an old monitor. Just rewire it so that when you plug it in the power goes too the lifter. If you explore J.L.N. labs site a while theres a explanation of how to rewire it. Found the link, only its in french. Anyway, I thought I'd post this even though I can't understand it.[not the french link] [because I'm not that educated in the area of physics]
    It looks like it would be applicable.

    [ZS] The link appears to just simulate the theoretical lift effect. I cant find the info on creating a power source.
  7. Mizar

    Mizar Premium Member


    [Mizar] hmm I looked at the pictures so what we are trying to do is create an electrical field to make a metal object float?

    If thats the case Im in I just scanned the thread so if it was all explaind im going to be editing this post...

    [ZS] Yeah we are creating an opposing electromagnetic field to lift an object. What we want to do though that hasnt been done before is lift the power source. A lifter wont be useful till it can support its own power source.
  8. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    Device Designs

    [Waxy] Square with an X through center.
    I've had this idea for awhile but only now am saying something. What if we build a square lifter and put an X over the gap? It might not do anything, but on the off chance that it does, we might learn something important. So, any volunteers?:D

    [Z] Any other design shapes? We must pin down a power source first however.
  9. PtballDan

    PtballDan New Member

    You can use microwave energy as a possible source- It would allow you to keep the power source on the ground but at the same time not have any power connected (physically) to the lifter.
  10. Mizar

    Mizar Premium Member

    How would you go about exactly doing that PtballDAn?

    I mean it looks like I'm going to be the one building this thing so please explain.

    When I get some time I'll start research and working on this.
  11. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    I've watched this research page on ATS for awhile and I think there is a connection between lifters and the B-2 electrogravitic propulsion. Here is a link to the research thread about the B-2.
    They have some good reading.
  12. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    I found something that might help with further antigravity research.
    I found this here. - Your Game Development Resource
    I'm going to find out more about this "super-conductor experiment".
  13. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    I am begining to doubt the validity of the superconductor experiment. Even so, here is a link on how to proform the experiment.
    When you see the pictures the same doubts will probably arise in your mind.
    My parents have given me a job with which I will earn 10 dollars a week. I will be putting most of this money into a Lifter. While I am still unable to find some insturctions on how to rewire a computer monitor or a TV, I am confident that there is a way. Lets hope I don't electrocute myself to death. :lol:
  14. trinitrotoluene

    trinitrotoluene Premium Member

    As far as my understanding goes for a capacitor, one end of it has a positive charge and the other has a negative charge, and all classical cases show they have equal magnitude in charge. This is explained as the removal of electrons from one end and the addition of electrons to the other end.

    My first questions are: If the positive side of the capacitor has a higher magnitude of charge than the negative side, where do its electrons go? If the negative side of the capacitor has a higher magnitude of charge than the positive side, where do its electrons come from?

    This almost sounds like you are trying to create a monopole - which (so far) cannot exist in nature. Of course, there would be a counter-charge, but one that would be weaker than the test charge. Nevertheless, anything that ends up with a very high overall charge can become very dangerous. Anything with a strong negative charge would become magnet-like for electronegative elements, and anything with a strong positive charge would become magner-like for electropositive elements.

    Perhaps I don't know enough about this kind of stuff, but I did take the "Scientists and Engineers" version of general physics, and something like this was never discussed, not even in the blurbs they interject about current advanced physics projects.
  15. Zsandmann

    Zsandmann Premium Member

    pdoke2003 has aquired the materials needed to build the lifter so this project is officially live again. Anyone involved originally, please u2u me so we can get a new team roster, also anyone else interested is free to join, please u2u me to be added.

  16. sardion2000

    sardion2000 Member

    Remember to record altitude of your location as well, because with all the reproductions that I have studied so far, there seems to be deviations in the amount of trust depending on location even with nearly identical models, which altitude seems to be a major contributing factor. I believe it has to do with the amount of Nitrogen in the atmosphere in your locale.

    Yes this experiment works, I've done it myself. It's quite neat, too bad it doesn't work in a vacuum. :( Oh well, TANSTAAFL.
  17. pieman

    pieman Premium Member

    enamaled wire!!!2 day delivery
    okay, a bit late for this thing, but if anyone has any problems with materials in future, u2u me, i work for an engineering supplier, on the buying end, thousands of companies on our supplier list, i should be able to help with some of 'em!!
  18. pdoke2003

    pdoke2003 Premium Member

    well, no such luck so far. ive got everything built and tested several times. i'm getting thrust but somethings still wrong. eaither its not putting out as much thrust as it should or the lifter is too heavy. im currently going through the trouble shooting steps provided with the instructions i downloaded. ill try and post some pictures tomarrow.

  19. Waxy cheesecake

    Waxy cheesecake Premium Member

    YAY!!!!!!!! Someone actually built it!
    Wonderful, I shall be looking forward to those pictures if you ever get around to posting them.
  20. pdoke2003

    pdoke2003 Premium Member

    sorry lots of school and work this week. but ive got the whole weekend open. hopefully then i can do more work and post some pictures.